Tea/ArcheryBalance

Archery in CUTT is currently much improved over some of its previous implementations, and thus is not incredibly shit.

Something which is quite noticable, however, is that most uses of archery in skirmishes or fights involve arrows which do STRIKEDOWN. This is impeded by people needing to listen for and identify the call to work out what effect they need to take, which is quite problematic when it's going to be a strikedown, due to the delay and confusion in hearing a call.

So here's a fix. This doesn't affect the balance much - it nudges the XP cost around very slightly, and that's about it.

Targeteer (10xp):

Level 1 (requires Wilderness 2): Call DOUBLE STRIKEDOWN by bow or crossbow

Level 2 (requires Wilderness 5): Call QUAD STRIKEDOWN by bow or crossbow

Level 3 (requires Wilderness 8): Call HEX STRIKEDOWN by bow or crossbow

Missile competency (10xp) (requires Warrior 1 or Subterfuge 1):

Call SINGLE STRIKEDOWN by bow or crossbow.

Now, there are certain circumstances where you really do want through damage. However, all arrows shoudl do strikedown, so that the target can react reflexively to being hit by an arrow by taking or resisting a strikedown. Therefore,

Sniper (10xp):

Level 1 (requires Wilderness 3): Call SINGLE THROUGH STRIKEDOWN by bow or crossbow

Level 2 (requires Wilderness 7): Call TRIPLE THROUGH STRIKEDOWN by bow or crossbow

As a side effect, this helps hold archery down as an alpha strike tool, while keeping it nicely useful against monsters and in fights. One possible option would be to open up the Sniper tree to Subterfuge as well, as it fits fairly well.

A final feature of combat archery is how to make it safe when you're shooting someone in defense at very close range. The best way to solve this is to have some form of call to indicate "I have fired but it isn't OC safe for me to actually do this, so take the following damage call". Therefore, the following little set of rules can go into the combat rules somewhere appropriate:

So, if an archer has a close-range clear shot that they don't feel comfortable actually shooting for reasons of safety, they may instead call:

LOOSE [Damage call] STRIKEDOWN

This will automatically hit the torso of their opponent. They must then fully unload their bow or crossbow, before reloading and shooting agaain. This call should only be used at very close range, and with very unambiguous targeting - the purpose is to enable you to get "that red demon charging you" at the last possible moment, not to snipe through a melee.

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I have mixed feelings about "loose" - on the one hand, I don't particularly like being shot at close range, and in some circumstances I'd far rather see it used than see the archer take the shot (on the 3ygb I was actively encouraging Tea to use this rather than shoot me); on the other hand, I can see it leading to bad blood as to whether or not a shot would have been certain to have hit, especially among people who pride themselves on their ninja matrix skills. Possibly allow targets the option to respond "no, do you worst" or similar? Or does that slow things up too much? --Jacob

That would slow things up for me to the point of unusability. I would expect the range cap on LOOSE to be in the 1.5-2m range where you are basically certain to hit, though I'm yet to work out what to do if it's called on a target with a giant shield. --Pufferfish

My issue would be that it could make archery into point-and-click Backstab, especially in the bar. Since bows aren't the most common weapon I think Rule 7 seems the best way to police this. If someone's yelling LOOSE all the time rather than actually shooting, people will notice. Could an easier solution to thinking time be to yell the call as you fire, then whoever is hit takes it? There's little room for confusion as few things do THROUGH or STRIKEDOWN without a vocal or clear circumstances like Backstab. Shields are a pain, yeah. A big one can block point-blank arrows. Perhaps allow people with large shields to RESIST damage from a LOOSE if they feel it's ambiguous, but take the STRIKEDOWN? --Jim

So someone is 8m away, there's a large fight going on, and they've just taken an arrow from one of the several archers all shooting. Even if they have the best will in the world for taking it, how fast they react to the call is massively slowed down, and the bit which might be key - strikedown, so they're on the floor and easier to hit - will be delayed by a few seconds. --Tea

I haven't yet bothered making the wording about that too explicit. Large shields would be covered by "clear shot" imo. Using it still requires nocking an arrow and readying your bow, and for cases like "shooting from surprise" you should be able to pull the shot massively, as your target isn't doing much running around. On the dodging issue, I am willing to demonstrate on someone wearing plate just how fast an arrow from a 30lb bow at full draw reaches you at 2m distance. The answer is 'oh gods', and also 'ouch, that hurt'. --Tea

What do you think such a test would demonstrate? --TimB

That at approximately 2m range with a clear shot, the arrow basically will hit, matrix skills notwithstanding. --Tea

Give me a shout if you need an Excessively Keen volunteer to get shot... --MorkaisChosen

If this was done, I am hugely in favour of Subterfuge getting Sniper. Currently the default call is THROUGH, which has the potential to combine nicely to finish off something you Backstabbed. This is why I took Targeteer on my Subterfuger. Something else worth mentioning is that Missile Competency is IMO overpriced right now. 10 XP for SINGLE THROUGH, or 19 XP (Wilderness 1 and Tageteer 1)for SINGLE THROUGH, SINGLE STRIKEDOWN, Wilderness RP skills and access to Track, Camo and Detect Race. Strikedown on the other hand seems like a much better reason to carry a crossbow around. --Jim

Note that I've also up-priced targeteer and rearranged it, so missile comp is worth more comparatively. It's now a 40xp splash to get Targeteer 1. --Tea

Another thought: I think that having archers on the field makes combat more tactically interesting. What do people think about encouraging people with bows to bring them by making it possible to splash targeteer in any spec? --Jacob

I think that the slight buff to missile comp of doing strikedowns and thus being useful is possibly enough there. Perhaps the best way to encourage them is for the refs to encourage them turning up on monsters (like shields) - a skirmish where both sides have a source of strikedowns can become hilariously fun and interesting. (To expand on this: in my experience I have occasionally volunteered to bring bows and then been told "no, there won't be any encounters", in much the same way as this sort of issue happens for shields and so on. Making bows more common is best solved socially, I suspect - the society has them, and when encouraged to bring them uses them, as proved by last 3ygb). --Tea

I like the current version of Targetteer and do not think it needs buffing or indeed changing at all. Other than that I tend to agree with what you say about encouraging them on linears. As several people have noted lately, most of our linear encounters are basically statted with something which equates to low level warriors (a few hits, a damage grade by melee weapon, maybe some armour). In descending order, you then get progressively fewer monsters with backstab, spells or missile weapons. Before you think about changing the skill, think about changing the environment. --TimB

You'll note that the damage progression basically doesn't change, the price is changed by a tiny fragment of xp here and there. The biggest difference is that every arrow carries a strikedown, and there's a few small tweaks to go with it. From experience using it, the major headache is getting people to take the strikedowns. This fixes that, without making it *better* in other ways. --Tea

Please don't take my Wilderness shiny away, the tree is sparse enough as it is! (the ability to call Strikedown is often more important than your exact damage call if you've got a mate with a sword, which you usually do) --Pufferfish

I disagree with your decision to remove the odd damage grades. Breakpoints make for crazy builds. --I

Hrm. How about:

Targeteer (5xp):

1. SINGLE STRIKEDOWN
2. DOUBLE STRIKEDOWN
3. SINGLE THROUGH STRIKEDOWN
4. TRIPLE STRIKEDOWN
5. QUAD STRIKEDOWN
6. QUIN STRIKEDOWN
7. TRIPLE THROUGH STRIKEDOWN
8. HEX STRIKEDOWN

I also note that I've tried to distribute the skills around, so that between Targeteer, Sniper, Weapon Comp and Weapon Expertise, and Surefootedness, you get something new in each level. Whether I've got that right or not is open to question, but I've tried for distributing the skills out a bit - wilderness is already quite bitty, so well designed bitty skills actually serve to make it more smooth and consistent overall.

--Tea